How to successfully grow a startup brand and drive growth in the German market - Tim on the Wyngs Podcast
Andrea Vaugan, Founder & Operating Partner at Wyngs, interviews Tim on how to approach the German market and the critical steps to launch a brand successfully. Listen now!
[Musik]
So was ich sehen, was die meisten companies machen, und die meisten companies
machen, die auch auch US-Kamten, die auch in die
Deutschland-Market, die auch die meisten Facebook-France-Kamten, die auch in
die
Deutschland-Market, die sich einfach kapiontätigen sind. So das
basically means just translating them, nicht even paying attention to
cultural differences. Und natürlich, wir alle schon nicht arbeiten, aber
aber wir sind aber auch noch überrascht, dass es nicht arbeiten kann,
wenn wir sehen die Results.
[Musik]
So, willkommen, Tim, zu der go-to-gemony-Podcast,
der podcast, wo wir uns überlegen, wie sich die
Deutschland-Market und auch wie sich die Brand in die
Deutschland-Market, ich bin wirklich, wirklich happy, zu haben
auf mein Podcast heute. Für alle, die gibt es einen
Tim, ich habe noch einen Tim für ein paar Jahre jetzt. Und ich
kann sagen, dass er die Fonder der Japa, die
Leading, B2B, Tech-Sass, Growth-Agency in die
Deutschland-Market. Und wir haben viele
Diskussionen über, wie zu leuchnen, in die
Deutschland-Market und wie zu Speed-Up, Growth und auch
your branding in die Deutschland-Market. Ich bin
wirklich happy, zu haben, Tim, willkommen.
Thank you so much for having me Andrea.
It's a pleasure to be on your podcast.
You know, I love podcasts, so I'm always excited
to talking about tech stuff, marketing stuff, also for
this conversation, very excited to diving into this.
Yeah, so you know, I told you I was a little intimidated
because you have your own podcast also, which is very
successful, the revenue marketing podcast.
And I really recommend everyone to listen into this
podcast, because it gives a lot of insights and I've
shared it a lot with our clients or prospects already.
So I hope I'm going to be up to the task, but I think
it's going to be okay. So Tim, please present
yourself a little bit. Tell us what you do, what you do
at Yaba, and then we dive into the topic of today.
Yeah, sure. So almost five years ago, I actually co-founded
your Yaba together with my dad, which already in itself is
probably kind of a crazy story, I would say.
At least that's what most people tell me.
And we basically started as a kind of a basic online
marketing agency that then quickly transitioned into
a highly specialized, to a tech agency for B2B SaaS
and tech companies, taking care of all the different
growth activities, such as course demand generation,
mostly on paid channels, but also organic growth,
which is becoming more and more popular, actually,
because it's very efficient. So going deep into thought
leadership content on kind of optimizing the inbound buying
experience. And basically taking care of all the
initiatives that drive pipeline and revenue through
inbound demand, so to speak, that makes sense.
And we call that revenue marketing.
Yes. So the challenge that we have when we talk to
brands that want to launch the German market and your
real, real expert, I know you also do international
campaigns, but your real expert for the German market.
So, and you have worked with French and international
brands also launching in the German market. So,
what is always a challenge for us is to explain to
our clients or to our ecosystem how to approach the German
market and what are the critical steps you have to take to
really launch a brand. So when we talk about scale ups,
then normally they already have a brand in their whole market.
They already exist. They have clients. They have a product.
So it's not a small startup trying to, you know, get a
little bit of traction, but normally they want to go big in
Germany quickly. What do you, what are the first, let's say,
advice or how do you onboard those kind of clients?
What is really the critical points that they need to do in
the very beginning to be able to have something that they can
scale than in the German market?
Yeah. So I'm assuming that all the research and the
decision on a specific market has been done before,
because of course the due diligence on a market should
always be step number one. And after that, I like to call
the further steps the three M's. So for me, that's mindset.
Then market differences. And then third one is mechanics.
And I think also it's very important to put them into that
specific order because the mindset on how you approach a market
is crucial. Because for me, it's kind of a,
it's an evolution of your whole strategy and not a quick
tactic. And to understand that on its core level, I think
it's very essential because in your original market when
you were building, for example, your product and your
audience and your customers in France, you wouldn't be
just kind of throwing budget on all different activities,
but you would act and do it like a real startup, you know,
you would build bridges between the different steps and
also do different things when you raise your seed round,
your serious A, your S.B, etc. And maybe you're now past
your S.B. and you want to internationalize more. But that
doesn't mean that you should kind of use the same methods
that you and tactics you do now in France, also kind of
copy and clone them towards Germany, but you should
rather start how you would have behaved in your seed round in
France now with the same mindset in Germany, for example.
And I think it's highly important to, when you internationalize,
to be that startup in its early stages once again,
and not the scale-up that you're in your home country.
And I think understanding this, that it's really a strategy
kind of focus and not a quick tactic is this highly important
to start with.
The first step that you said, which is interesting,
and maybe we can just come back to it a little bit because
this is the preparation for the mindset, is the analysis
of the market and really understanding the ICPs,
the customers, the needs that they have.
This is something that I think is really very crucial too.
So you said, okay, it's a prerequisite when they come to you,
or maybe this is also something that you can do for your clients.
Do you have any advice on how to do that very thoroughly?
Because of course, we know, and this is also based on research
and all of our experience, a German client doesn't buy any product,
service, or software, as a French customer, for example.
We have different decision cycles.
We have longer decision cycles.
We need different kind of information.
So what would be your advice to really do this research and how deeply should
it be?
Yeah.
So I think the research is part of the second M-Den,
which is the market differences, which goes very deep into the research,
as you say, and I fully agree how important it is.
Because if you have the mindset that you are a startup now once again,
what do you do when you start up in your home country?
Well, you go very deep into your SAP analysis,
and you understand that you don't have product market fit yet when you receive
startup, right?
And that you should also understand when you go into a new country.
You should assume that you don't have product market fit yet.
And then you take all the steps that you also did before in your home country,
so that you can be certain that you have product market fit in your new,
the country that you expand into.
So to understand the market difference,
I think it's important to split into legal and cultural.
First and foremost, I think legal is quite obvious.
Here in Germany, we have the GDPR,
which basically regulates how you handle a prospect's data,
and then we have the PECD, which regulates how you kind of reach out to a
prospect, right?
And I'm sure there's similar laws in France, but I think it's important to
really have a look at them
and check in with your lawyer before you actually take any action.
And that box, you can probably check off quite quickly.
The cultural mod, of course, is a little bit more tricky,
and you probably need to do more research, talk with more people and potential
customers,
and it will take more time.
I think all the steps you've done before for your home country, you should also
do for the new country.
You should look at all the competitors that exist in that market.
You should look at their communication, how they kind of go into the market,
and how you kind of...
So it's basically for the strategy questions, I like to think into questions.
It's, where do we play?
Right? So now you have a new playing field with that new country,
and new playing fields have new rules.
So you need to look at how does that market really work?
And then the second question is, how do we win?
And answering how you win is basically analyzing all the things that other
companies do,
and then picking your game plan or playbook that will define how you win in
that market.
And I think all the work you've done in order to reach product market fit and a
level in your home country
that have kind of given you the opportunity to even internationalize,
you should do all the work again for the new country.
I think maybe you will talk about it when you talk about the mechanics,
but because I think what's interesting is also that sometimes we...
People are less patient with a new market, because they say, "Okay, we have...
Word."
We have...
I think you should repeat that sentence one more time.
You need to be more patient.
Yeah.
Because, of course, you think, "Okay, we figured it out.
We have found product market fit and all home market, and we know how it works.
We know our customers, we know ICP, we know all of the unique selling points
and everything.
They're less... and they forget that it took them months and years to build
that information.
And I think it's a good basic information that you can build on when you go in
another market
and you can set up hypotheses of what should work, what work at home, what
could work.
But then you have to take the time and test everything again.
And sometimes we see companies that start campaigns or ads or those kind of
initiatives
and they get upset very quickly because it doesn't work.
So maybe you can tell us how this testing mechanism, you know, A/B testing
and also testing different messages, testing different use-piece, different IC
Ps
is also part of what you do.
Because I think this is something where people get...
I see people sometimes, you know, or companies stopping campaigns after two or
three months,
I said, "Okay, we don't have the right KPI.
It's not working.
We have to stop.
We have to do something differently."
Yeah.
Yeah.
So when we talk about the mechanics, we can kind of check the box that we have
kind of done legal work, right?
So we have set the legal foundations.
And as you said before, I think that it's important to dive into our ICP very,
very deeply.
So we need to define our ICP one more time.
We can't just copy paste the same ICP.
We need to define it for the new market.
And that also means that we need to select new use cases.
Because of course, for German countries, very different use cases are relevant.
Then there are for French companies.
So we need to pick the relevant ones.
And of course, if you're...
I think the best case would be that before you enter a new market, you already
have some customers in that country.
And you already have some success stories.
Because if you don't have that, you will have a pretty hard time.
So I think that should be your very first goal to win your first customers,
make them successful,
and then also create really, really compelling, well thought through detailed
oriented case studies.
Because Germans like to go very deep also in understanding the cases and they
read everything.
Especially if you're not a German company.
Because you need to show that they can trust you.
So the more detail you can add to the success stories and case studies, the
better.
And then you need to also of course define new KPIs.
And I think that will go in stages.
Because the KPIs you look at within your first quarter will be different than
after your fourth quarter in a new market.
So it should be kind of an evolution of your KPIs.
So to say, I think in the first quarter it would not be the best idea to
measure your success in net new AR.
For example, right, I think we can all agree on that.
But maybe after the fourth quarter, I think it should be quite relevant to
measure success on AR.
And that you have to define with your leadership team.
What are the different stages of the North Star metric so to speak of how we
will measure success in a new country.
And once we've done that, I think it's highly important to approach your
creative strategy.
And by creative strategy, I mean start from the bottom once again.
You've done your research now.
You know the pain points in the market. You know what competitors do.
You know how you will win in that market.
And now it's important to craft a creative strategy that is only relevant for
that specific market.
So what I see what most companies do and almost all companies actually do that.
Especially also US companies going into the German market, but also most French
companies going into the German market.
They just copy and paste their playbooks.
So that basically means just translating them.
Not even paying attention to cultural differences.
And of course we all somehow know already that it doesn't work.
But somehow we're still surprised that it doesn't work after we've seen the
results.
And it's a completely different story if you're taking something that exists
already and you translate it versus creating something new from scratch with
your new research.
And I think that's very important that you go very deep into that.
So when you've created your first campaign for your home country, you also
created a creative strategy.
So you've done your research, you've selected the pain points, you've crafted
your messaging.
Basically what is the story that we want to tell?
Some people also, and I also like to call it strategic narrative.
What's our narrative for our product and for our customers and everything in
between?
And how can we distribute our story not only through all our different go-to-
market departments such as marketing sales, customer success, success.
Everybody needs to be in board, but also through all different channels.
So that's events that also all the digital channels.
So probably linked in Meta, Google, your website.
If you don't have a localized landing page, I think at least you should have a
landing page in German for example.
You don't need to have, I think you don't need to have your whole website in
German in order to go into the market because that's a crazy lot of work to do
first kind of test.
But I think you should have at least one landing page that all of your
campaigns can kind of lead into so that you actually show, hey, well at least
we're trying and we're making an effort to provide you in your native language
and to understand you better.
So yeah.
So you said in the beginning and it's interesting because it's also a question
of the size of the company and the resources that they have that they're disp
osed so you mostly work with scale up so companies that really also have the
firepower to do those kind of things.
Very often what we see in the practical world is that they do not have
customers in Germany.
I know how important social proof is in Germany and that you need logos that
you can recognize that Germans can recognize big logos that are known.
So let's say you have international clients.
I don't know, could be a France or aliens or those kind of companies that you
already have that you can use.
But you know to really understand and find German customers if we talk about
the German middle strand also so the SMB companies in Germany.
How do you, can you, what kind of channels would you, let's say, advise
companies to use in the beginning because you know have such a big portfolio of
things that I can do from events to social media to ads to newsletters.
To whatever webinars and all those kind of things.
So how would you build it up from the beginning? Let's say I want to start my
scale up in January 2025 in Germany.
What would be a little bit the sequencing to be able to build it up in the
right with the right resources also?
It's a great question.
And that's exactly what you should think about after you've done your creative
strategy. So you know your story and you've selected the channels.
So that's particularly relevant for the German market to warm up the market
before you go heavy into sales mode.
Because if if if German people have never heard about you ever before and you
outreach them, I think your chance of success are very minimal.
It's much better if you provide value first without having the intention of
winning customers right away.
So that means maybe creating a webinar, maybe creating even a local podcast,
maybe even kind of picking subject matter experts within your country.
A sorry, not country company that will post in the German language very
regularly on LinkedIn, for example.
So really kind of creating that demand, providing that value at scale through
different through different materials and assets.
And I think what works great here and that's that's a kind of something we've
also done with, for example.
So we've done the go to market for play play and pay for it. And what we've
done there also is that we co hosted webinars with brands that are already very
popular and relevant in the market.
And there's always different also SaaS companies, but maybe sometimes even
service providers or agencies that kind of compliment your product really,
really well.
So if you can pick them and ask them to do a co hosted webinar, for example,
you will appear next to the brand that's already known to German people so that
already gives you an advantage in terms of trust.
And not only that, I think another step that's that's highly relevant and pay
for it at the so pay for this in the HR space.
And in HR there's a lot of business creators, D2B influencers, thought leaders,
however you want to call them, that have a lot of of reach and have a huge
audience, especially on LinkedIn.
And I think what makes a lot of sense is if you cooperate with them for a set
period of time, so not just for one promo post because that doesn't really work
, but kind of use them as
Yeah, kind of brand ambassadors almost. So you go into an agreement for like
maybe six months, if that's your or maybe 12 months, if that's the time that
you want to prove your success of your go to market and then do different
events with them. So do webinars do so they should write linked in post maybe they can also be
featured on your website maybe they can give you a quote maybe they can even
use your product and show how the product is inserted into their own workflow
etc.
Because thought leaders nowadays I think they have so much attention and are so
underpriced because so few B2B companies actually use them. It's kind of like
it's kind of like a gold mine still.
It's like the early days of when when first influences were used for B2C in e-
commerce that's how we're now will in B2B.
And I think there's there's a huge advantage if you kind of do a webinar in
Germany with a German thought leader in your vertical in your industry and they
will invite their audience into the webinar.
So you will have a lot of trust and you also have great content that you can
record and then distribute on all other channels and use also in your campaigns
because of course it's part of your strategic narrative and your story because
you've picked also the theme of the of the event for example.
That will give you a great great way to warm up the market to only focus on
demand creation to create new net new demand in a new market for a couple of
months and only then focus on on capturing the demand that you've created
already because you will have a much higher level of trust.
Okay, so now if I look at the classical playbook of a scale of wanting to go to
the German market.
The question is now mostly what we see is that because I agree with you if not
I wouldn't have you thought because I think it's really the right way to do it.
But what we see in reality very often and it would be interesting on how you
convince your clients and maybe also help your clients convince their boards
and also their investors basically to invest in warming up the market without
having revenue goals from let's say months sometimes we see it months three or
four or five or six because basically what you say is that you can go six
months nine months maybe 12 months depending on your product.
Depending on the sales cycle that you have without doing any revenue.
So the idea is how can we get people to understand that this warming up of the
market is so important and then basically because what we see is that people go
in and then they do outreach they do LinkedIn they do called email they do
funding they do all of those things when I think that they can close a deal
very quickly and they want to have the you know the low hanging fruits and the
quid wins and all those things.
And basically what they should do is what you just said warm up the market and
then try to build on that but it's the other way around and this is also what
sometimes even the board and the investors don't really understand because if
you go and be to be sus and you say you want to work with inference as they're
going to say no no what we want is revenue we want customers we want to lead
you and pipeline everything.
So how do you convince people that this is the right way to go and how can you
help them convince you know be the internal heroes to defend this kind of
strategy when we talk about country managers or marketing managers.
Yeah, I think I think it's it's it's a really tough challenge because I've
experienced so many times exactly this conversation and it applies to so many
different things also.
But I think a great way is to of course also bring external experts who've seen
it so many times into the conversation someone like yourself you've seen it so
many times how it should be done if you've been brought into the conversation
you can bring the relevant arguments that actually then make sense so you can
actually execute like that but.
On the other side I think I think at the end of the day you will be need you
will be needed to find kind of a compromise so that you can go kind of yes you
need to capture demand and you need to show success but also then you need to
be able to warm up the market and I think it all comes down to aligning on a
mindset right so what's the mindset that we have when we go into the market now
How can we how can we establish shared beliefs that will that will align us on
also the success then and when you have the mindset that you can define KPIs
and I think we've talked about this earlier on on this podcast and that you not
pick for example new one logos for the first month for example as your nostarm
etric but rather you you pick for example engaged accounts or something like
this you know.
And then you can you can really work your way through and the KPIs you will
pick they will make all that they will make all the difference to be honest
because if you pick engaged accounts and then maybe the next stage is maybe you
see a brand uplift in the country.
From Google searches that would make make sense or maybe even you will see an
increase in company followers on LinkedIn from from German people and accounts
from your ICP in that country etc.
And so that you can really work your way through in a way that it makes sense
and that will also support your initiative and your your tactic of warming up
the market first before capturing it.
And so maybe if you yeah go ahead yeah if you if you really make that if you
presented in a way that it's completely logical you bring someone in like
yourself that has seen it many times and can support this this kind of way of
working.
Then I think also investors will agree that it makes most sense to do this and
also show them the threats if you go especially in Germany heavily into sales
mode of like needing to win clients in the first week.
Your brand will be highly damaged and I think that's a huge threat also if you
if you want to see this as a long term play and it should be a strategic long
long term play not a quick tactic as we've discussed at the beginning.
Yeah so I think when we go back to the mindset what is interesting that I think
that the first step of the mindset will basically be how do I prepare this
project and prepare everyone who is part of this project.
Even before you pitch it to your investors or even before you pitch it to your
board is to basically build up the international project with this mindset in
mind if you can say it like this you know is that you say okay what we will
what we are looking for is building up and growing a market on the long term.
Even though we have some short term metrics but then you have to define short
term you know short term for a start up can also be nine months or 12 months to
have some you know really strong KPIs like sales for example but to really have
this in mind before you start crafting the project is to say how we're going to
how we're going to craft this whole project together and what kind of mindset
do we have to have from the beginning of building it up this is why we also
because as I said.
Mostly the KPI that we see for the international project is sales pipeline and
so we say you need to get other KPIs into the discussion in knowing the market
talking to the client talking to the prospect having partners building up a
network all of those kind of things understanding the culture understanding ICP
all of those are also really strong KPIs that you have at least for the first
six to 12 months that you need to that you need to get in and this is why I
think the earlier you be able to do that. The earlier you build up this is what we call a little bit international by
design because this is the further the earlier you build up this kind of
mindset into your company and into your investors and you start pitching the
story from the very beginning.
The easier it will be to convince them to do what you just said and to build a
common belief on how we should start this project.
And also I mean you need to be you need to be you build you build new
structures right and it can also be considered a complete phase shift in your
company kind of journey of building your startup and for every phase shift.
Of course you need to prepare months if not years in advance so I fully agree
with you the earlier you start the better.
Yeah and maybe when we think about because I know that you have been to an
event in the US and last and we talked a little bit about this how to create
you know the difference approaches on branding and communication that we can
see because we're in this as field right we talk about text or there's a lot of
you know American communication of course that is we see every day.
What do you think is the and then we said okay is there maybe an American way
to communicate and the European way to doing branding and those kind of things
what do you think is really crucial to build a European brand so not to have
like a French startup that also has activities in other markets but to say okay
I'm a European company and I have a European branding.
So I think first it's important to define what brand what's branding and for me
it's how people in your market talk behind your back when you're not in the
room pretty much and that is defined by every single interaction that they have
with your company right so I think it's it's it's better to look at.
Like what kind of way of doing business is is really relevant and it's what
people look for in that new market that we should talk about first and then we
can see of how we can actually adapt that within our company for that specific
market that will be of course executed by different people then for other
markets of course and something that quickly comes to mind is especially you've
talked about the German middle stand before is to really keep it formal.
They don't want to be talked to in this startup is slang language that we like
to talk in the tech space here they want to be respected they want to start
formal into a conversation and if you decide after the third fourth of fifth
call that you want to make it a little bit more informal then that's completely
fine if you have that consent.
So I think that's that's highly relevant the next one is and I think that's
that's very typical for Germans to keep it really task oriented when you're in
a conversation because we're Germans were all about efficiency.
So don't do too much you know like small talk at the beginning but like start
into be kind of structured be well prepared be task oriented get the task and
if there's time at the end for some other chatter that's completely fine but
you need to be efficient in in your way of business and also in your follow ups
for example if you promise to follow up same day or next day you need to do
that if you don't you you've lost that trust.
And that also comes to the next point which is reliability not only with your
follow up but also just be on time I know especially in the US people don't
value that as much as German people but German for German people it's really
important if you're five minutes related considered as highly disrespectful.
So I think that's that's a crucial time sorry crucial thing and then also just
doing what you said you were going to do that's that's how you win when the
trust and then of course I think now when I think about it I think Germans kind
of prefer written over spoken communication a little bit more.
So especially I mean it's fine to to have a call especially when scheduled of
course and also to be spontaneously called sometimes but there should always
also be written communication where everything is like documented in an
official kind of way in German in German yes via email not not only on LinkedIn
or Slack which is kind of an unofficial channel but like on email I think that
's that's important.
And then I think it's important to especially in a professional context really
treat business first and then private second if at all to be honest yeah I
think that's important to keep it.
That's a big difference between that's interesting because you know in in in
France for example what can happen to you is that you meet a business acquaint
ance the first time over lunch which is something that does not so much happen
in Germany is you meet someone I don't know linked and you say.
Okay let's have a coffee let's go for lunch and then you meet and this is a
little bit different in Germany way first build up the you know before sharing
a meal you build up some kind of relationship basically and here it's a
different so this is one of the cultural differences so.
And one more thing I would like to add is this and I think that's highly
important especially for for German people is a complete transparency over how
you handle data.
Like a don't try to kind of to chat or like kind of like go into gray zone or
kind of thing that you can trick German people because we're so smart here
about data and we take privacy and all that kind of topic so so seriously that
the better you are the more transparent you have you the more transparent you
are the more trust you will gain from those people.
And if you have maybe even a landing page where you show how you handle that
data maybe even a video where someone explains it specifically that will that
will really win hearts here in Germany.
Yeah we have done a review of many German websites even especially the bigger
ones like the big text that upset our Germany and most of them actually have
what you say this kind of landing page where they only talk about the different
certifications they have on e-zo GDPR how they handle data and it's something
that we always recommend.
We just not always understood because it's not so complicated to do you just
have to build the page and you know at the text it's not that complicated but
it's really something that is that is important for the for the German market.
So this is really interesting to have this special localized information from
you and those tips on how to prepare especially for the middle stand which is a
big big target group is there maybe a last tip that you can give on the middle
stand how to reach them and how to really because you know there is so many of
them you know people from
5,000 to 25,000 companies depending on the size that you that you see and it's
something that we do not have so much in France this really big big big strong
group of SMBs how do you reach them.
Yeah I think I think we've talked about many great things already one thing
that we haven't mentioned I think is they love personal interactions and
offline events.
So if you have the chance to create local events small minimum size or big any
size and kind of meet them there offline not only on LinkedIn or digital
channels I think that will give you a huge advantage and I think that's
something that you should highly highly consider in your in your go to market
strategy and playbook especially when trying to win German companies.
So there are a lot of conferences in Germany that are kind of where a lot of
these middle stand companies actually go to so you won't find many startups
usually on those conferences so you if you can pick and choose the conferences
for your industry and you start there with maybe buying a booth or just going
there to talk and understand them first I think that will give you a lot of
value.
All creating your own events like some dinner events or lunch events or maybe
with a partner doing a road show in different in different locations to invite
yeah prospects and okay so many great content thank you Tim with completely
again you know stretched the time that we had but I think it was very valuable
advice from you so thank you very much.
So tell me what is the exact use case where people should call Tim to launch
the German market what would be the best use case for you what kind of company
should come and talk to you when they want to conquer the German market yeah
yeah yeah so we usually work with B2Bs us and tech scale ups that are mostly
past series A but usually past series B and really have really are in the deep
growth phase.
And I think you should I think I mean of course any time where you want to go
into the German market it makes sense to contact us either just for consultancy
and we will also tell you when it's a little bit too early if you still need to
do more due diligence or research on the market or kind of yeah just your legal
topics first but once you've done this and you want to localize your creative
strategy and create a completely new creative strategy for the general market.
For the German speaking market for the I think that's exactly the moment where
we come in and we can really craft all with with all of our experience and
inside the German market your your ideal creative strategy and and strategic
narrative also the story that you want to then distribute on all digital
channels.
Okay and you have done it so many times before and again the leading agency for
those kind of use cases in Germany so thank you very much Tim I was really
looking forward to doing this podcast and I think we've done a good job and
given a lot of good advice. Thank you.
Thank you so much Andrea yeah enjoyed a lot great questions and yeah very
excited to to seeing yeah some comments maybe maybe some further questions from
listeners.
And of course everybody's also welcome to message me a link in any time.
Yes and check out your own podcast revenue marketing podcast. Thank you Tim.
Yes, speak soon.
Thank you.
Thank you for tuning in to another episode of Go to Germany Stories.
I hope you enjoyed today's insights and found them very valuable for your own
journey.
If you have any questions stories to share or topics you'd like me to cover in
future episodes feel free to reach out.
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Until next time keep pushing forward and making your mark whether you already
in Germany or on your way despite.
* Musik *